I spanked my children until last fall. I wish I never had. That said, I quit and I can’t believe the difference it has made. We can talk about things, there is less lying, they respond to their friends with more gentleness instead of hitting.

It’s hard for me to admit that even though I looked like a great parent to everyone else, I wasn’t. I have made the transition from a punitive/restoration parent to an attachment parent, but it’s taken me 10 years.

I had to relearn patterns that I had learned as a child.

After I read To Train Up a Child three years ago, I ripped it into little tiny pieces and threw them away. For one day I tried their techniques and I will never forget the sadness and pain I caused.

Tulipgirl, you were very influential in my life in years ago helping me debunk the Ezzos and then the Pearls. But it took a few more for me to see that spanking does not achieve any of the goals I have set for my family, and even worse it hurt the spirit of my children and made them think that I am out to get them instead of me being a friend to them put here to help them on their Christian journey.

Also, I would recommend the first volume of Charlotte Mason’s series. We could all use a bit of old fashioned wisdom… children have not always been beaten. That is a lie. Once you start looking for it you will find a better way. I can’t say for certain of course, but I don’t think Jesus would EVER strike a child.

Thanks, Tulip Girl.

On top of that, it was poorly translated by men who were steeped in their culture. many verses are poorly translated, another unrelated one is the word, “Helpmeet,” that was wretchedly translated. I really cannot find justification in the Holy Bible for beating a young child.

Discipline is what is mandated in those verses. The Bible neither mandates nor does it forbid spanking. I have found disciline to be much more complex than simply beating my children with a literal rod.

Discipline is relational. To be honest, when aI look back at my childhood, I learned my lesson the most when I saw the look of disappointment in my parent’s eyes. They didn’t have to actually *punish* me, disappointing them, falling short of the mark was enough. Why? Because I loved my parents and hated to see that look in their eye. It was much more effective than the times I was spanked.

Same with my children. The relational element of discipline is what is the substance of parenting. I do not need to physically hit my children because we are so connected with one another, I can guide them and provide boundaries without actually using physical force.

But another thing to consider is that these are ALL OT passages. The OT shows God’s judgment, but the NT shows his Grace. In the OT we were commanded to stone our children in certain instances. So if you are a literalist to the extent of thinking we must beat our children with rods to Scripturally parent then you should be stoning them as well.

The following quotations come from the King James Version (KJV) of the Bible:

Prov 13:24: “He that spareth his rod hateth his son: but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes (diligently).”
Prov 19:18: “Chasten thy son while there is hope, and let not thy soul spare for his crying.”
Prov 22:15: “Foolishness is bound in the heart of a child; but the rod of correction shall drive it far from him.”
Prov 23:13: “Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die.”
Prov 23:14: “Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell (Shoel).”
Prov 29:15: “The rod and reproof give wisdom: but a child left to himself bringeth his mother to shame.”

Discipline and beating are different.

The rod is modifying the subject of the sentence; discipline.

Also the rod for the back of him is devaid of understanding (what version is that? Devaid, please, but I digress,) that person is an adult, not a little child.

And, do we beat adult criminals? NO WAY. But that verse was directed at adults, but yet we don’t beat hardened adult criminals. and there is an advocacy for treating children more harshly than hardened adult criminals?

And, please don’t suggest that advocating a more grace-filled gentle approach toward babies and little children is a trick from Satan. I would say anyone that is seriously advocating beating little children in God’s name may have some issues of her own. And I am holding back and you are trying my patience; please do not suggest people on this board are agents of satan. You are offending good Christian people who simply hold a different opinion on an issue that is not doctrinal. And, a word to the wise; you *really* don’t want to mess with me as anyone who knows me will tell you. And one more thing, please don’t put Strong’s on the level of Scripture.

In fact, the word, “train” is not part of my parenting lexicon at all. The verse, “Train up a child in the way he should go,” was poorly translated from the original Hebrew. The Hebrew word is “Channuk” which is more correctly rendered, “dedicate.” (the same word is the root of the Jewish word, “Channukah,” which is the feast of the rededication of the Temple.) I am to dedicate my child in the way he should go.

This rendering is more in harmony with basic Christian philosophy.

I can find no reason to spank my children. It just isn’t part of who I am. My children aren’t perfect, but five out of the eight are legally adults and their fruit is good.

And what is outlined in No Greater Joy is downright beating (not a swat to the bum,) and practicing such draconian methods would be considered abusive in much of the nation’s jurisdictions.

Spare the rod and spoil the child is not in the Bible. When the rod is mentioned in the Bible, it modifies the word, “Discipline.” and is a metaphor for discipline. But, bear in mind, the shepherd’s rod was not used to beat the sheep, it was used to guide the sheep, it was used to beat predators.

Those are pretty strong words to lob against a sweet godly woman like Tulipgirl.

I don’t recommend using the Bible against Believers. Who was it that used scripture to tempt and discourage? Hmmmm? No, I won’t go there, especially to defend people that preach abuse against children. Bless Tulipgirl for her efforts to protect innocent children and prevent mothers and fathers from the heartache of regret when they are finally exposed to the concept of grace that is so central to the message of the Bible.

I can’t be the judge of your state of legalism or anything else.

If you have convictions, that’s great and I respect you for that.

Just don’t question my salvation if I wear a bikini, go to school, and use noncoersive parenting methods.

Legalistic? Nah, but I am very conservative, more so then most.

I could go into detail but it may be off topic.